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Bugsy_malone 666
Jedi Master
Joined: 19 Mar 2008
Posts: 394
Location: Near the Hells mouth known as Basingstoke
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 Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 2:17 pm Post subject: What Flywheels can be used with vwinline 4s ? |
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right I have a KEP adaptor plate and no flywheel (annoying) but it only cost me 40 quid (yay!) got my golf motor bolted to a beetle gearbox but because I want to head for the 200-300bhp power mark the bug box wont cut the butter, a bay box will though!
So from what I can tell the KEP adaptor plate moves the engine away from the stock gearbox by 25mm putting it in the same place as if I was using a Diesel bell housing off the T25 ( I think thats right?) With that in mind I am thinking that the obvious one is a T25 diesel flywheel will be the ticket.
However I cant say I have seen any T25 flywheels for sale in a while so my question is: What other flywheels can I use?
I been looking at passat 1.9TDi (mid 90s) ones as at least unlike most golfs they are the right way round (flywheel on the engine!) and also corrado 16v, but they all seem to look different despite the fact they all fit the same engines and all have the standard configuration like beetle/camper clutches.
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RobScott
Initiate Jedi
Joined: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:43 pm Post subject: |
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passat b3 flywheel will fit if you have enough room in the bellhousing.. it wont fit in a beetle box as the clutch is too big (228mm). but will fit in a bus box, pluss you have the advantage of 228mm clutch. (you need the clutch disk off a bay or t25 tho as the splines are different on the passat.
i have a b3 228mm flywheel and clutch pressure plate in good condition, you can have for 30 quid... alltho postage will be a bit due to weight. |
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Bugsy_malone 666
Jedi Master
Joined: 19 Mar 2008
Posts: 394
Location: Near the Hells mouth known as Basingstoke
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| Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 12:38 am Post subject: |
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sounds just the ticket and a good price, question is where in the universe are you?
the T25 did have a 228mm clutch on one of them too so it would be spot on, would probably just need to look into getting an upgraded friction plate maybe, dont know how a stock clutch would take 200bhp+ might be alright I guess!
Have you got a picture of the flywheel?
I'm curious about depths you see and clearing the adaptor plate.
Then obviously the next question is if the flywheel is that much bigger, how on earth will it engage with the starter in stock position, I am guessing thats another adaptor?
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13 window deluxe
Jedi Guardian
Joined: 22 Dec 2006
Posts: 861
Location: chesterfield derbyshire
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| Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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hi bugsy ive got a t25 diesel flywheel on the split with a bug box and i had to move the ring gear as it wouldnt fit inside the bellhousing so be careful!it's only the 020 golf box was a reverse operating clutch the 02a boxes in the corrardos golf tdi's and vr6's are all normal opperation and 228mm clutch. the 2.9 vr6 corrardo was 192 bhp from the factory with a 228mm clutch in a 02a box so the clutch can take the power. what engine youfitting in bug?
_________________
1964 rat 13 window deluxe 1Z tdi,
1975 rhd twin slider tintop (TBA)
1991 golf 2 gti with tweaked AHU tdi,
previous tdi swaps: gone but not forgotten
1979 rhd twin slider tintop bay ahu 1.9tdi
1990 T25 1Z 1.9tdi
1993 suzuki samurai with 1Z 1.9tdi |
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13 window deluxe
Jedi Guardian
Joined: 22 Dec 2006
Posts: 861
Location: chesterfield derbyshire
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| Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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and my starter is on the engine adaptor plate not on the original gearbox hole
_________________
1964 rat 13 window deluxe 1Z tdi,
1975 rhd twin slider tintop (TBA)
1991 golf 2 gti with tweaked AHU tdi,
previous tdi swaps: gone but not forgotten
1979 rhd twin slider tintop bay ahu 1.9tdi
1990 T25 1Z 1.9tdi
1993 suzuki samurai with 1Z 1.9tdi |
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Bugsy_malone 666
Jedi Master
Joined: 19 Mar 2008
Posts: 394
Location: Near the Hells mouth known as Basingstoke
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| Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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| 13 window deluxe wrote: | | hi bugsy ive got a t25 diesel flywheel on the split with a bug box and i had to move the ring gear as it wouldnt fit inside the bellhousing so be careful!it's only the 020 golf box was a reverse operating clutch the 02a boxes in the corrardos golf tdi's and vr6's are all normal opperation and 228mm clutch. the 2.9 vr6 corrardo was 192 bhp from the factory with a 228mm clutch in a 02a box so the clutch can take the power. what engine youfitting in bug? |
ok my starting block is a mk3 golf 2 litre block, PB 8v head although I also have a KR16v head if I fancy(just it doesnt fit well in the bugs engine bay). Thats the engine as a starting block which would only be 115-147bhp area. I'm running stock digifant injection system but will be throwing a turbo or supercharger (depending on what I see first at the right price) on it so estimated figures are aimed at 200-300bhp with a bit of playing.
This is why I was planning on moving to a baywindow gearbox as its a bit tougher.
I know bays also came with 215mm clutch sizes on the type 4 engines (or was it bigger?) and T25s have the 228mm flywheel. So Really its just finding the mix and match parts .
I am wondering with the 228mm flywheel if I might indeed need to hunt for a T25 gearbox as that should be ok to take the flywheel? also might be able to get some better gearing than a 1600 bay box although apparently they arent all that strong!
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13 window deluxe
Jedi Guardian
Joined: 22 Dec 2006
Posts: 861
Location: chesterfield derbyshire
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| Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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the t25 diesel clutch is 215 mm, only the wasserboxers are 228mm. the 2.0 bay type 4 engine had a 228mm clutch. if you use a 091 bay box that was designed for a 228mm clutch so no messing. 200-300 bhp from a 2.0 8v motor with a turbo have you been smoking crack again  without running stupid boost and a crossflow head and loads off internal mods to hold it all together etc your going to be just over 150 bhp even if you can get fueling near right and it doesnt melt straight away but defo less than 200bhp if you want power use a 1.8 20vt there worth next to nothing a early 150bhp agu motor can really make 250bhp with big injectors turbo fuel pump etc
_________________
1964 rat 13 window deluxe 1Z tdi,
1975 rhd twin slider tintop (TBA)
1991 golf 2 gti with tweaked AHU tdi,
previous tdi swaps: gone but not forgotten
1979 rhd twin slider tintop bay ahu 1.9tdi
1990 T25 1Z 1.9tdi
1993 suzuki samurai with 1Z 1.9tdi |
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Bugsy_malone 666
Jedi Master
Joined: 19 Mar 2008
Posts: 394
Location: Near the Hells mouth known as Basingstoke
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| Posted: Fri Nov 13, 2009 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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| 13 window deluxe wrote: | | the t25 diesel clutch is 215 mm, only the wasserboxers are 228mm. the 2.0 bay type 4 engine had a 228mm clutch. if you use a 091 bay box that was designed for a 228mm clutch so no messing. 200-300 bhp from a 2.0 8v motor with a turbo have you been smoking crack again without running stupid boost and a crossflow head and loads off internal mods to hold it all together etc your going to be just over 150 bhp even if you can get fueling near right and it doesnt melt straight away but defo less than 200bhp if you want power use a 1.8 20vt there worth next to nothing a early 150bhp agu motor can really make 250bhp with big injectors turbo fuel pump etc |
na I aint been smokin out, I just have a goal and some parts so I'll see what I can do.
The G60 was a 1.8 with 160bhp? question is how much different was it, I am starting with a 2litre, going to look at dropping the diesel crank in to give it more stroke. have to focus on a fair bit of charge cooling to stop it going sill but we will see what I can achieve, so far in 12 months I have already changed my mind several times (hence 8v & 16v heads) obviously 16v was 147bhp out the factory, apparently KR lowers the compression ratio so suitable for forced induction.
I just have plans, doesnt mean I'm crazy yet 
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RobScott
Initiate Jedi
Joined: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 12:24 pm Post subject: |
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i'm in preston, lancashire.
the passat flywheel isnt bigger than the t25 item, just a bigger clutch. i dunno about the offset tho, i did measure it when i was sorting out all the options. |
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Bugsy_malone 666
Jedi Master
Joined: 19 Mar 2008
Posts: 394
Location: Near the Hells mouth known as Basingstoke
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| Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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If I do a rough drawing of the flywheel and the measurements I need then could you please measure for me?
My g/fs folks are up in Heywood and I'll be up at xmas time so might be able to pick up then if its the right spec I need/I dont find something sooner.
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RobScott
Initiate Jedi
Joined: 16 Oct 2006
Posts: 39
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| Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2009 11:14 am Post subject: |
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yeah i'll take some measurements for you. i'll bring it home from the garage today,  |
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13 window deluxe
Jedi Guardian
Joined: 22 Dec 2006
Posts: 861
Location: chesterfield derbyshire
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| Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2009 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Bugsy_malone 666 wrote: | | 13 window deluxe wrote: | | the t25 diesel clutch is 215 mm, only the wasserboxers are 228mm. the 2.0 bay type 4 engine had a 228mm clutch. if you use a 091 bay box that was designed for a 228mm clutch so no messing. 200-300 bhp from a 2.0 8v motor with a turbo have you been smoking crack again without running stupid boost and a crossflow head and loads off internal mods to hold it all together etc your going to be just over 150 bhp even if you can get fueling near right and it doesnt melt straight away but defo less than 200bhp if you want power use a 1.8 20vt there worth next to nothing a early 150bhp agu motor can really make 250bhp with big injectors turbo fuel pump etc |
na I aint been smokin out, I just have a goal and some parts so I'll see what I can do.
The G60 was a 1.8 with 160bhp? question is how much different was it, I am starting with a 2litre, going to look at dropping the diesel crank in to give it more stroke. have to focus on a fair bit of charge cooling to stop it going sill but we will see what I can achieve, so far in 12 months I have already changed my mind several times (hence 8v & 16v heads) obviously 16v was 147bhp out the factory, apparently KR lowers the compression ratio so suitable for forced induction.
I just have plans, doesnt mean I'm crazy yet |
i know what your saying the (pg) g60 engine is just a reworked gti engine and g60's are about 160bhp stock but to get 200bhp or just over you need stage 4 charger, chip and pulley, gas flowed head, special grind g60 cam and thats alot of cash about £4k to get 40bhp and there still breathless at higher revs the 16v is alot better engine for power. vw motorsport did a few limited edition g60 16 valves they were the boy!!!! low down torque from charger and power at high revs from 16v head :-). if i was going down the budget tuning route i would use a 2.0 abf 16v and turbo that use mega squirt fuel injection once mapped correctly that would get you 200bhp with low boost and last for ever
_________________
1964 rat 13 window deluxe 1Z tdi,
1975 rhd twin slider tintop (TBA)
1991 golf 2 gti with tweaked AHU tdi,
previous tdi swaps: gone but not forgotten
1979 rhd twin slider tintop bay ahu 1.9tdi
1990 T25 1Z 1.9tdi
1993 suzuki samurai with 1Z 1.9tdi |
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